Battery woes

wattfield · Nov 21, 2016

My 200Tdi Defender has been having trouble starting in this cold weather. It would start OK as long as the radio & the heater were switched off, but sluggish if anything was on. This morning it failed to start after being unused since Friday. It charges up OK and starts better with a full charge.
Question is - it's a 643 battery, 96Ah, 680cca, higher rated than the recommended 069, but should I go for something with a bit more oomph?

Turboman · Nov 21, 2016

wattfield said:
My 200Tdi Defender has been having trouble starting in this cold weather. It would start OK as long as the radio & the heater were switched off, but sluggish if anything was on. This morning it failed to start after being unused since Friday. It charges up OK and starts better with a full charge.
Question is - it's a 643 battery, 96Ah, 680cca, higher rated than the recommended 069, but should I go for something with a bit more oomph?

Did it start up OK last year with the battery you have?

wattfield · Nov 21, 2016

Turboman said:
Did it start up OK last year with the battery you have?

It was a bit sluggish in the coldest weather, but it wasn't charging well at the time. I solved that, just dirty connections from the alternator, and it worked fine after that.
I'm quite sure the battery's past it's best, just wondered on what other folks recommend.

Turboman · Nov 21, 2016

wattfield said:
It was a bit sluggish in the coldest weather, but it wasn't charging well at the time. I solved that, just dirty connections from the alternator, and it worked fine after that.
I'm quite sure the battery's past it's best, just wondered on what other folks recommend.

Would have thought direct replacement is the easiest route. What you have is plenty big enough for that engine.

If it doesnt start up easily with new battery, glow plugs might be worth a check.

wattfield · Nov 21, 2016

Cheers!
It usually starts without the need for glow plugs, although I do use them.

mikescuba · Nov 21, 2016

I have a 110A battery and when it gets very cold that too can appear a bit sluggish. ( -18C ) I cleaned the earth terminals which made quiet a difference. I also have a battery isolation switch which I turn off over night which I find also helps, although I have had it checked to see if there is any power being drawn when off and none was detected.
When it comes to changing batteries I always go for the biggest and best I can afford. My Defender can end up standing for several days in very cold temperatures. Luckily its a very good starter. The engine hardly turns over before firing up. It has stood for 4 months over the winter early this year. Fired up almost immediately.
If your engine is turning over but not firing up then I would check the starting mixture/ glow plugs. Mine pushes out a puff of black smoke on start up. I just jump in and turn the key, I don't wait for glow plugs to warm up or anything like that. I have always been lead to believe that 200 tdi's are good starters unless something is wrong with them.

lynall · Nov 21, 2016

I would just fit a new battery and go from there, nothing worse than an unreliable car.
Search tayna batteries and enter 069 decent prices with good quality.
My 200 has an extra couple of earth cables, fitted by po so he must have had issues.

https://www.tayna.co.uk/069-Car-Batteries-G22.html

Both my 200 motors can stand for months at a time, battery isolator on and they always start.

Al2O3 · Nov 21, 2016

wattfield said:
My 200Tdi Defender has been having trouble starting in this cold weather. It would start OK as long as the radio & the heater were switched off, but sluggish if anything was on. This morning it failed to start after being unused since Friday. It charges up OK and starts better with a full charge.
Question is - it's a 643 battery, 96Ah, 680cca, higher rated than the recommended 069, but should I go for something with a bit more oomph?

I've just replaced my battery on Saturday. The one I've just replaced is 70Ah 560. It has worked fine for years and I've been lucky also with a 300Tdi that starts first crank in the summer and after about two in the winter. It hadn't been used for over two years while I did the rebuild and I was amazed it still worked when I put it back on. I thought when we hit the frosty mornings it would start to struggle and it did. It's the Mrs' daily drive to work and on Friday we had a hard frost and she said it only just turned over. I decided to get one with a bit more guts, just for extra peace of mind. Bought a 110Ah 760CCA. It's BIG. Fits in the battery box ok, but not a lot of room left above it and the metal cover of the seat box. If you are going for something with a bit more oomph check the dimensions before buying. Mine's a Lion and I paid £115 for it with a 3yr guarantee from the local motor factors. You can get them a bit cheaper online.

Turboman · Nov 21, 2016

Al2O3 said:
I've just replaced my battery on Saturday. The one I've just replaced is 70Ah 560. It has worked fine for years and I've been lucky also with a 300Tdi that starts first crank in the summer and after about two in the winter. It hadn't been used for over two years while I did the rebuild and I was amazed it still worked when I put it back on. I thought when we hit the frosty mornings it would start to struggle and it did. It's the Mrs' daily drive to work and on Friday we had a hard frost and she said it only just turned over. I decided to get one with a bit more guts, just for extra peace of mind. Bought a 110Ah 760CCA. It's BIG. Fits in the battery box ok, but not a lot of room left above it and the metal cover of the seat box. If you are going for something with a bit more oomph check the dimensions before buying. Mine's a Lion and I paid £115 for it with a 3yr guarantee from the local motor factors. You can get them a bit cheaper online.

That should certainly do the trick!

Just fitted one of those in my tractor. 4 litre, 4cylinder diesel with 30 to 1 compression!
Think I paid about a hundred quid at the battery wholesaler.

Al2O3 · Nov 21, 2016

Turboman said:
That should certainly do the trick!
Just fitted one of those in my tractor. 4 litre, 4cylinder diesel with 30 to 1 compression!
Think I paid about a hundred quid at the battery wholesaler.

It is a tad over the top

However, while the body is now more or less new the engine is 20yrs old and more or less untouched. The Mrs works about 15 miles away from home and, because of the rural county in which we live, there are no buses if it doesn't start. Worth paying a few extra quid for a bit more grunt for those -10 mornings

I phoned the motor factors up to see what they had in and I settled for that one. The Mrs and the mother in law were going in to town and so they picked it up. I must admit, tractor battery was the first think that went through my mind when I saw it.

If you paid £100 for yours I think I did ok at the motor factors at the local town at £115. (11 miles away).

IamRobbie · Nov 21, 2016

I reckon bigger the better when it comes to batteries. My toy 90 cracks up straight away without any pre heat even if it's stood for months without being touched. The 90 I've just brought for the road seems to struggle unless you give it plenty of pre heat. Reminds me of my old 19j engine. The battery on my work van died last week I guess it's just the cold weather that sorts the good from the bad. Atleast it's sorted now before the real bad weather comes

Al2O3 · Nov 21, 2016

IamRobbie said:
I reckon bigger the better when it comes to batteries. My toy 90 cracks up straight away without any pre heat even if it's stood for months without being touched. The 90 I've just brought for the road seems to struggle unless you give it plenty of pre heat. Reminds me of my old 19j engine. The battery on my work van died last week I guess it's just the cold weather that sorts the good from the bad. Atleast it's sorted now before the real bad weather comes

What did you put on it?

IamRobbie · Nov 21, 2016

Al2O3 said:
What did you put on it?

The work van? Standard battery that Ford recommend for a transit I would guess. I didn't have to put it on as according to work we are not allowed to even change the wheel so the aa bloke did it. I know it cost about 140 quid from the aa. The battery box in a 90 is a decent size. Big enough to cram two batteries together or get one large battery in there I should imagine

Al2O3 · Nov 21, 2016

IamRobbie said:
The work van? Standard battery that Ford recommend for a transit I would guess. I didn't have to put it on as according to work we are not allowed to even change the wheel so the aa bloke did it. I know it cost about 140 quid from the aa. The battery box in a 90 is a decent size. Big enough to cram two batteries together or get one large battery in there I should imagine

Misread your post there. Thought it was the 90 you had just replaced the battery in. You've obviously got a big battery in the 90 though!

IamRobbie · Nov 21, 2016

Al2O3 said:
Misread your post there. Thought it was the 90 you had just replaced the battery in. You've obviously got a big battery in the 90 though!

The battery in my 90 is one a friend gave me out of his disco before it was scrapped so I wouldn't say it was big. It's always fired up well It could be the additional earth's it has on it maybe? Once the weather improves I plan on checking the earth's on the other to see if it fires up any better. A friend of mine has a 200 in his and that takes a few turns to get fired up. Strange really

wattfield · Nov 21, 2016

What do you reckon? Hankook or Lion? The Lion is identical to my current battery.
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/644-643-S...445035?hash=item43f80d876b:g:HAwAAOSwMtxXvXgM
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Type-643-...972125?hash=item5d64323b5d:g:S4kAAOSwaG9XImpA

Al2O3 · Nov 21, 2016

IamRobbie said:
The battery in my 90 is one a friend gave me out of his disco before it was scrapped so I wouldn't say it was big. It's always fired up well It could be the additional earth's it has on it maybe? Once the weather improves I plan on checking the earth's on the other to see if it fires up any better. A friend of mine has a 200 in his and that takes a few turns to get fired up. Strange really

They all have their little quirks.

wattfield said:
What do you reckon? Hankook or Lion? The Lion is identical to my current battery.
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/644-643-S...445035?hash=item43f80d876b:g:HAwAAOSwMtxXvXgM
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Type-643-...972125?hash=item5d64323b5d:g:S4kAAOSwaG9XImpA

They are both more than adequate. The 4 yrs warranty would swing it for me and it's got the bigger capacity. I've had neither make before, though just got a Lion on Saturday, so no experience to share there. The dimensions are there, so I would check it will fit in the seat box. Mine fits in with left side of the battery slid right too the front of the battery box. With the battery sat in the middle of the box the right hand terminal was too high for the seat box lid to go on.

lynall · Nov 22, 2016

Turboman said:
That should certainly do the trick!
Just fitted one of those in my tractor. 4 litre, 4cylinder diesel with 30 to 1 compression!
Think I paid about a hundred quid at the battery wholesaler.

30.1 ratio, what sort of engine has that got?

Turboman · Nov 22, 2016

lynall said:
30.1 ratio, what sort of engine has that got?

Perkins 4/248. Might be only 28 to 1, not really looked into it, but most old Perks run about that. Landrover diesels were always very low comp, probably because it was originally a petrol engine.

Oldseadog · Nov 22, 2016

Check and clean your earths before throwing away cash on a new battery that might not be required!

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