Air leak

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NikTheGeek

NikTheGeek

New Member
Posts
626
Location
Wigan
I replaced all 4 bags last month. But now it seems I have a leak. I can park for as little as 10 mins and when I come back, it's in access mode and rises quickly. But... it never gets lower than access mode. It doesn't go to the bump stops if left over night or a couple of days. Just to access mode. It also always rises to normal very quickly.

Anyway, is the attached the self leveling relay? If you take it apart its more than just a relay. Its a relay with an entire circuit board attached. Anyway, if it is, I've just pulled it out to see what happens. But what do you think? No faults show on Nanocom...

Nik
 

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The unit is a timer relay....it activates every 6 hours to allow the ECU to relevel the car....

With it unplugged, and the car drops a corner...this will indicate a leak...if it remains level, then it points to a Height sensor issue or the vehile isnt parked level
 
I would guess you have a leak if it drops that quickly, maybe a pipe not fully seated in the airbag and has backed off a bit. I can park mine at all sorts of angles and it doesn't drop since I overhauled it.
 
Thanks both. I'd heard the timer was supposed to activate every 6 hours but this can be after 10 mins. Also, I've noticed that when I come to a stop (engine still on tickover) the car is self-leveling then too). I turn it off, go away for 10 mins+ come back and start it and it raises and self-levels.

I've took it out so I'll see in the morning if it is a bag. If its a sensor playing up, I assume I can clean them with switch cleaner?

Nik
 
That was interesting! Last night, with the engine running, I opened the tailgate to freeze the EAS. I then measured the height of the suspension. 48cm from the centre of the wheel to the middle of the wheel arch all round. I then turned the engine off and pulled the self-levelling relay out, shut the tailgate and locked it up.

This morning it hadn't dropped at all. Not so much as a mm on any corner!

At least that means I did a good job fitting the bags! :)

I've put the relay back in so I'll see if it drops now. But rather than try it, can I not leave that relay out? Or will it give an error?

Nik
 
Saint.V8 said:
Potential Error causer as when you switch on the ignition the ECU may throw a wobbler when it sees something is missing!
Click to expand...

I figured. I have Nanocom to reset it, but there's still no point causing a problem if I don't need to! Yes, I do know about WD40 BTW. A good water dispersant, but thats about it :) However, back to those sensors. Won't they need to be lubricated anyway? And if so, with what?

Even if a sensor was kaput, with the engine off, it would only self-level once every 6 hours. Unless that 6 hour figure is incorrect, or it's year/model dependant. I guess the self levelling system could be broken or overactive. I'll see later as I've just put it back in...

Nik
 
NikTheGeek said:
I figured. I have Nanocom to reset it, but there's still no point causing a problem if I don't need to! Yes, I do know about WD40 BTW. A good water dispersant, but thats about it :) However, back to those sensors. Won't they need to be lubricated anyway? And if so, with what?

Even if a sensor was kaput, with the engine off, it would only self-level once every 6 hours. Unless that 6 hour figure is incorrect, or it's year/model dependant. I guess the self levelling system could be broken or overactive. I'll see later as I've just put it back in...

Nik
Click to expand...
Dropping over a period could be a height sensor or driver pack etc.
The 6 hour figure is approximate but is the same for all years.
 
Well since taking the delay timer out and putting it back in again, the car has behaved. It hasn't dropped a centimetre on any corner since. Whereas before, it would drop to access mode after a few mins.

Maybe a coincidence. Maybe re-seating the delay timer cured it or maybe pulling it out reset something. No idea. But for now, it's working 100% :)

Nik
 
NikTheGeek said:
Well since taking the delay timer out and putting it back in again, the car has behaved. It hasn't dropped a centimetre on any corner since. Whereas before, it would drop to access mode after a few mins.

Maybe a coincidence. Maybe re-seating the delay timer cured it or maybe pulling it out reset something. No idea. But for now, it's working 100% :)

Nik
Click to expand...
Corroded contacts maybe, removing and replacing cleaned them up.
 
Ah, spoke too soon. I've worked out the pattern.

If I start the car on the drive, let the EAS level. I can turn it off and leave it for a full day or more and it doesn't drop so much as a millimetre. However, when I drive the car it seems to drop because when I come to park, if I turn the engine off straight away, the car is down in access mode. If, however, I let the car idle for a few moments, it self-levels and then is fine again.

So, is that normal? I know the levelling as I drive is normal, but surely it should be adjusting itself to be slightly either side of normal height? I assume the height sensors are ok if it self-levels on the drive fine? Any thoughts why it would drop whilst driving?

This is short journeys. Once on the motorway, it drops to motorway and then comes back up again. But on short journeys, down to the farm to see the horses, its almost in access mode by the time I get there and if I turn the engine off, its in access mode when I start back up - hence thinking I had a leak. No leak though as I can prove by it staying put at whatever height it was last set at.

Nik
 
NikTheGeek said:
Ah, spoke too soon. I've worked out the pattern.

If I start the car on the drive, let the EAS level. I can turn it off and leave it for a full day or more and it doesn't drop so much as a millimetre. However, when I drive the car it seems to drop because when I come to park, if I turn the engine off straight away, the car is down in access mode. If, however, I let the car idle for a few moments, it self-levels and then is fine again.

So, is that normal? I know the levelling as I drive is normal, but surely it should be adjusting itself to be slightly either side of normal height? I assume the height sensors are ok if it self-levels on the drive fine? Any thoughts why it would drop whilst driving?

This is short journeys. Once on the motorway, it drops to motorway and then comes back up again. But on short journeys, down to the farm to see the horses, its almost in access mode by the time I get there and if I turn the engine off, its in access mode when I start back up - hence thinking I had a leak. No leak though as I can prove by it staying put at whatever height it was last set at.

Nik
Click to expand...
Look at the height sensor actual readings. Otherwise I have to think there is a leak under certain conditions such as when there is a lot of suspension movement. Might be worth checking the compressor temperature when you get to the horses, I suspect it's over working and cutting out on temperature.
 
Why don't you lock it in position with the button .
I don't bother with motorway level I leave it in locked normal hight all the time uses the compressor less. On the morning when I start the car it re levels to normal hight within seconds and off you go . Some times when I stop at lights or have just parked up , it will do a slight re level on the front but always stay at normal height untill requested to change to access or wade.
 
defender300td1 said:
Why don't you lock it in position with the button .
I don't bother with motorway level I leave it in locked normal hight all the time uses the compressor less. On the morning when I start the car it re levels to normal hight within seconds and off you go . Some times when I stop at lights or have just parked up , it will do a slight re level on the front but always stay at normal height untill requested to change to access or wade.
Click to expand...
So the height sensor will move over a shorter range and never push the crap up the track, also less safe at speed, why not fit coils for the same effect?
 
Datatek said:
So the height sensor will move over a shorter range and never push the crap up the track, also less safe at speed, why not fit coils for the same effect?
Click to expand...
Depending if grand pa is getting in or I'm over the rough track at the farm I change I did say when requested , plus i thought you said they were sealed .
 
defender300td1 said:
Depending if grand pa is getting in or I'm over the rough track at the farm I change I did say when requested , plus i thought you said they were sealed .
Click to expand...

The height sensors are sealed but the tracks wear and the crap collects at each end of the normal movement range. IMO it's a good idea to let it rise and fall as required and the motorway setting improves stability at speed.
No point in having EAS if you don't take advantage of it's benefits.
 
After a night of self levelling it has to pass the low hieght tracks and in the morning when it raises to normal hieght passing the low hieght track position again .
Even if unlocked on normal hieght the car only goes inbetween the two hieghts of normal and 25 mm lower for motorway . So for it to do a full travel of the track would would have to use high and Access mode so by locking it makes no odds to the latter two .
By locking the eas it reduces use of the compressor between normal and low hieght ,thus prolonging the life of the air compressor .
As for stability and safeness at 25mm its Negligible.
The point of having the eas sysem is its use , more to the point of haveing a smoother comftable ride compaired to coils .
 
defender300td1 said:
After a night of self levelling it has to pass the low hieght tracks and in the morning when it raises to normal hieght passing the low hieght track position again .
Even if unlocked on normal hieght the car only goes inbetween the two hieghts of normal and 25 mm lower for motorway . So for it to do a full travel of the track would would have to use high and Access mode so by locking it makes no odds to the latter two .
By locking the eas it reduces use of the compressor between normal and low hieght ,thus prolonging the life of the air compressor .
As for stability and safeness at 25mm its Negligible.
The point of having the eas sysem is its use , more to the point of haveing a smoother comftable ride compaired to coils .
Click to expand...
Regardless of everything else mentioned....25mm is quite a lot with regards to CoG stability, hence why LR installed the Motorway height reduction!

Whilst I am a decent Design Engineer and have worked on a few complex design jobs, I still wouldn't question LR on their decision to install a 25mm drop at motorways speeds, they know the design parameters and the vehicle handling behaviour far better than most of us would!

As a Design Engineer, your role is to see what can be left out as well as what can be left in....why over complicate the design for the sake of it, why go to the additional cost of deveolping and testing a motorway mode if it wasn't necessary....the P38 was designed that way, IMO let the system decide for itself its best operating parameters....and as for the compressor not having to work as hard, how many times do you go above 52mph and then drop below 30mph then back up to 52mph again??
 
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