new head gasket has failed:( help needed please

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squiz34

Member
Posts
61
it would appear im still losing water :(.

i have changed the head gasket and as this was my first one i dont think ive done it right(yes i hear all the ...heres another one...but we all gotta learn right.)....anyway.......all in all ive changed.....thermostat,inlet mani gasket...both done before head gasket.......then new head gasket(multi layer)...new head bolts..timing belt and auto adjuster....

as i am losing water i suspect its not right but its not over heating.

so unless anyone has a better idea of what else it could be my question is ....what out of what ive changed can i re use?...

..the plan is to re do it(properly this time)....eg...head skim,full drainage of oil and cooling system,engine flush.anything ive missed?


many thanks for reading and assistance.
 
Th member HTR renewed his head gasket and it was weeping coolant afterwards. There were issues with liners and types of HG to use.

There was a decent amount of discussion on it at the time and I can't find those threads, but have a look at his comments on this thread....

http://www.landyzone.co.uk/lz/f9/head-gaskets-saver-shims-270763.html

You can try searching for HTR and HG issues around September 14 - there's more info there. HTR's pretty competent with the spanners and his HG replacement failed, various others have not succeeded first time. You're not alone!
 
Did you check the liner hights before deciding on a MLS gasket? If not then this can easily cause a leak.
Look at the head/ block joint under the exhaust manifold. This is the normal place for the MLS gasket to leak.
If it's leaking there then the best option is fit the Payen elastopolimer gasket instead. The elastopolimer gasket is much more tolerant of uneven liners.

HTR knew from experience when he wrote post 12 on here http://www.landyzone.co.uk/lz/f9/hg-repair-just-quick-question-271991-2.html
 
Last edited:
I presume Squiz34, you are Gary. Might this be applicable to diagnosing problems,

re liners...

when i had head off one of them lifted when i undid the crankpulley as me clamping device moved.

re collant loss...

there is a small amount of water/oil mix on dipstick but im asumeing that was from liner moving and draining water from around that liner into sump.....car dows not over heat and heaters in cab all good too,but there is the sloshing from passenger side again.

and ...

im still losing water from expansion tank....not a massive amount but maybea cup every other day atm.

I don't know the significance of the liner moving on the K Series - but it may be relevant. The swooshing noise may be from air in the system if it was not filled completely, or air/gas getting in and circulating.

When I filled the collant on my L Series after refitting the IRD, it needed a few top ups afterwards of about the amount you mention - but then was OK.
 
GrumpyGel said:
I presume Squiz34, you are Gary. Might this be applicable to diagnosing problems,

re liners...

when i had head off one of them lifted when i undid the crankpulley as me clamping device moved.

re collant loss...

there is a small amount of water/oil mix on dipstick but im asumeing that was from liner moving and draining water from around that liner into sump.....car dows not over heat and heaters in cab all good too,but there is the sloshing from passenger side again.

and ...

im still losing water from expansion tank....not a massive amount but maybea cup every other day atm.

I don't know the significance of the liner moving on the K Series - but it may be relevant. The swooshing noise may be from air in the system if it was not filled completely, or air/gas getting in and circulating.

When I filled the collant on my L Series after refitting the IRD, it needed a few top ups afterwards of about the amount you mention - but then was OK.
Click to expand...

GG if a liner on a K series moves when the head is off, it breaks the lower water seal. This allows coolant to drain into the sump. The only cure is to reseal the liner. This adds to the repair time but isn't the end of the world.
 
When you had the head off did you check it with a steel rule and feeler gauge to see if it was ok and didn't need skimming.

I know this is going to sound like a dumb question, did you use a good quality torque wrench when you tightened the head bolts to the specified torque, i know some of the cheaper ones can be way out of spec.

How do you know the new head gasket as failed, water may be leaking from some where else, can you see any leaks, you could do a sniff test or compression test you don't want to start dismantling again if the head gasket is ok.
 
Last edited:
thanks for the help folks.....

i put steel rule across the head when it was off and looked against light...im sorta used to doing that sort of thing being an engineeer...and before anyone says why did i skim the head when off if ur an engineer....i was made redundant a week before xmas :( so had no machine to use.


anyway...i checked all plugs today just out of interest and they are all alike,not wet and looking at a w/s manual for another car pictures of plugs....they are normal.

still not over heating but down a little on water...not a cup full though...so ive bled it again difficult to tell if ok till i drive it .........how DO you know when all air is out btw?
 
:rolleyes: doing it by the book and the k series still play up- no skim is false economy
 
can i just say.........fanatic you have said two comments on this subject in a HELP forum...and well tbh neither comment is use nor ornament..if u aint gonna help folk then keep it to urself.........we all have to learn about our cars one way or another and yeah its the hard way sumtimes but hey we live and learn.

thank you to the rest of you for ur comments though i do take note of help when i need it cos if i didnt then i would need more help.


the fact im losing water and engine a tad noisier than before is my conclusion the fix wasnt/isnt fixed as it should be.....just the non overheating,heaters are perfect, is confusing that fact.
 
squiz34 said:
can i just say.........fanatic you have said two comments on this subject in a HELP forum...and well tbh neither comment is use nor ornament..if u aint gonna help folk then keep it to urself.........we all have to learn about our cars one way or another and yeah its the hard way sumtimes but hey we live and learn.

thank you to the rest of you for ur comments though i do take note of help when i need it cos if i didnt then i would need more help.


the fact im losing water and engine a tad noisier than before is my conclusion the fix wasnt/isnt fixed as it should be.....just the non overheating,heaters are perfect, is confusing that fact.
Click to expand...

Did you check the liners while the head was off?
 
TBH I think both Fanatic's were reasonable on this thread.

The first one determined what engine you're working on - which sort of helps a tad!

The second one gave one of his specific thoughts on what you should do on a HG replacement - whether you agree with it or not is another matter.

squiz34 said:
can i just say.........fanatic you have said two comments on this subject in a HELP forum...and well tbh neither comment is use nor ornament..if u aint gonna help folk then keep it to urself.........we all have to learn about our cars one way or another and yeah its the hard way sumtimes but hey we live and learn.

thank you to the rest of you for ur comments though i do take note of help when i need it cos if i didnt then i would need more help.


the fact im losing water and engine a tad noisier than before is my conclusion the fix wasnt/isnt fixed as it should be.....just the non overheating,heaters are perfect, is confusing that fact.
Click to expand...
 
squiz34 said:
can i just say.........fanatic you have said two comments on this subject in a HELP forum...and well tbh neither comment is use nor ornament..if u aint gonna help folk then keep it to urself.........we all have to learn about our cars one way or another and yeah its the hard way sumtimes but hey we live and learn.

thank you to the rest of you for ur comments though i do take note of help when i need it cos if i didnt then i would need more help.


the fact im losing water and engine a tad noisier than before is my conclusion the fix wasnt/isnt fixed as it should be.....just the non overheating,heaters are perfect, is confusing that fact.
Click to expand...

So the correct way to do it would be
Head skim if any doubt
Liner height and looseness- Don't rotate crank with head off
New head bolts
New rail
Dowels if not steel replace
Headgasket update and head set
New thermostat
And new cambelt and water pump
OAT

Been doing K series for almost half a lifetime
 
Further to this composite gasket with the extra mastic sealant beads on it and look for exhaust gas analyser coolant sniff test I have posted MANY Times.
 
When are you going to come to the party and help this guy? :doh:

For my own interest here, and hijacking the thread a bit, when you change the cambelt (at its normal intervals) would you also change the tensioner and idler as a standard matter of practice?

fanatic said:
So the correct way to do it would be
Head skim if any doubt
Liner height and looseness- Don't rotate crank with head off
New head bolts
New rail
Dowels if not steel replace
Headgasket update and head set
New thermostat
And new cambelt and water pump
OAT

Been doing K series for almost half a lifetime
Click to expand...
 
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